The Sahara boys after performing at Accrington Mela (yes Stanley fame) drove down to Cheetham Hill, Manchester to meet up with the desitunes4u northern dream team, which consists of the main man himself, northerner through and through, Irfan alongside the other northerner (well, technically, but lets not get into specifics) Usman! For those of you who may have heard of Manchester having a famous district for Asian Restaurants and takeaways, you would be right to believe so, but this wasn't an award-winning restaurant, but it certainly was popular, 100 flies can't all be wrong. It wasn't ideal especially with Sahara flying to India the following day; we just hope their stomachs survived the 12,000 miles around the globe! On their comeback to the scene did Sahara find the northern dream team to hot to handle? I guess it's time to find out!

The comments of each of them have been colour co-ordinated to help you distinguish who is saying what. The following key can be used as a guide to help you with this as well.

[Herbie, Usman & Irfan sat on one table]

Herbie: Help me out lad there two of these, they are ganging up on me.

[Laughter, then Gurps joins us]

Usman: How long have you been into the desi music scene? How did it all start for you?

Herbie: It all started from basically a young age. I was playing for local bands and stuff like that and then progressing from there. I used to sing 'Nachda Punjab' and things like that. We've always spoke Punjabi at home so I've always loved to infatuate with Bhangra music and stuff like that. We were having some bhangra dance rehearsals and I heard some music downstairs, I went downstairs and used to just go and sit down with them. I just started singing from there.

Usman: So they just let you start singing straight away?

Herbie: Well I did weddings and stuff like that previously. I used to get and start singing at the age of 11 at weddings.

Usman: What was your song?

Herbie: A lot of Alaap stuff.

Usman: Your last album, I personally thought was track for track one of the best albums I've heard. Before that or since then how much recognition did you get?

Herbie: Well before that we released a track called 'Tappe.'

Irfan: I love that track. That's the one you always kick off all the melas with, innit?

Herbie: Yeah, we still do that, it's a killer track and it always works so why change the format. Yeah like I was saying we released 'Tappe' and it really did well for us down South. From that the garage thing was just kickin and I think Surinder Ratten had just released his track and then we released Sonie Ni Sonie and that just took it to another level. Usman: You've been signed to Nachural Records for ages and ages and ages right so why all of a sudden have change record label to UntouchablesUK?

Sahara

Herbie: Nothing really, we just fancied a change.

Usman: Just fancied a change?

Herbie: Just fancied a change!

Usman: So just got up one day and thought you know what…

Herbie: Yeah, we just wanted a new direction and moved on.

Usman: So you weren't getting that direction from Nachural Records? So basically they weren't giving you the opportunity for that direction?

[Herbie & Gurps Laugh] [Herbie begins to look uncomfortable with this line of questioning, which prompts Usman to continue]

Herbie: Yeah, basically we've moved in the other direction and moved on.

Usman: So Nachural was taking you down a Road you didn't want to go?

Herbie: No…

Usman: You are saying it's a different direction so basically they must be taking you in a direction you did not want to go!

Gurps: End of day we wanted to be with someone who's at the forefront of Bhangra music and that's Untouchables and less travelling!

Usman: So you think they lagging behind, Nachural?

[Herbie looks quite stressed, maybe it was the heat of the day or just the heat from the cooking in the takeaway but I'm pretty sure he's sweating]

Herbie: No, like I said I just fancied a change and Untouchables is closer to home!

Usman: Close to home?

Herbie & Gurps: Yeah

Usman: I'm pushing to hear what I want to hear but I know I'm just not going to get it!

Herbie: I know what you want to hear [Everybody Laughs].

Usman: I'll catch you off guard in a bit; believe me I'll get back to that one. I'm gonna do a proper Martin Bashir style grilling on you, trust me!

Sahara In Manchester

Usman: Moving on, the bhangra seems to be at an all time high with a lot of mainstream interest at the moment. Do you think it's just a temporary thing or do you think bhangra is here to stay as far as the mainstream goes? Herbie: It's really really good that it's done so well in the mainstream. Maybe it's a fashion thing with all this Bollywood? Maybe it's just a phase but who knows.

Usman: Also, do you think it's good for bhangra, as we seem to be moving away from the roots of traditional bhangra?

Herbie: To a certain degree it's good but we mustn't forget our roots and that style of bhangra. I mean to have an album full of MC'ing only appeals to a certain market where as if you put the desi elements into it then it will appeal to everyone internationally and nationally.

Usman: Going back to the mainstream, have you got any plans?

Herbie: No, not at the moment.

Usman: Nothing at the moment?

Herbie: Yeah, well we don't really need the mainstream and all that, if it happens wicked but that is not our aim. Our aim is always been the bhangra music and desi music to another level; if it happens don't get me wrong it would be brilliant but if it doesn't then so be it.

Usman: So, nothing in the pipeline?

Herbie: No

Usman: When a desi artist uses a sample from mainstream music; we say rip off rip off. When Dr Dre does it where are like 'Wicked Wicked Wicked.'

Irfan: Just to re-iterate what Usman means. Sahara as artists, have tended to use the odd mainstream sample from time to time. Now when desi artists use mainstream samples they get slated for lack of originality but when the mainstream takes a liking to our beats and jack what want as when they please and we are like 'o wicked such a person has a Hindi sample on there next track.' What is your view on that? Is that fair?

Herbie: As long as it fits into the song and it needs it then it works but if the sample if about something else and the singing is something else and the singing is all over then that is basically kid and pickle to me. As long as the sample works and Dr Dre has used then fine, it really works. I mean you can't imagine that track without that sample. The same vice-versa as well, I mean someone's used that a sample and it's well produced and it's needed then fine, as long as it works.

Usman: Apart from singing or performing what do you all like to do in your spare time?

Herbie: No comment [Everybody laughs].

Herbie: For the last six months I've just been in the studio 24/7. I've been really hectic but no time for anything apart from that!

Usman: Sleep?

Herbie: Sleep, is a brilliant thing!

Irfan: The 'No Comment' means your not telling us something!

Usman: You get some female attention is that what you mean?

Herbie: I don't get involved!

Usman: You don't get females stopping you in the street?

Herbie: Only for directions!! Usman: Do your fans not recognise you on the street? Herbie: A lot of people do but I mean it's one of those things you know what I mean? Usman: So do you give them anything else apart from an autograph. Herbie: What is this interview for? Is it for	Sahara
the Sport or something [Everybody Laughs]?

Usman: Ok, so I'll drop that one then!

Usman: I see you as a band more of a 'live' performance. I see that as more of your repertoire than your CD's. I mean hearing you live is something else and the energy you put into it! Do you enjoy that more than being in the studio itself?

Herbie: Definitely, I mean we have done quite a few events and gigs and stuff like that. I mean that's when we really enjoy ourselves. I could turn up to a gig by myself and do a few songs but we are a band and we go together and put a performance on and we like to entertain the crowd so people are like it's really really good.

Usman: So it's like a band thing?

Herbie: Yeah, you know a lot of people but you know just go by themselves for the sake of it, I'm not going to get too public, and do a couple of tracks and are like lets get out of here. We like to do a good performance on stage.

Usman: Sticking with 'live' performance I have been to quite a few melas this year and basically the artists turn up mime and get lost basically! What's your view on miming on stage?

Herbie: Miming…

Irfan: Putting a CD on and just moving your lips! Do you think it's selling the public short?

Herbie: The thing is a lot of the people out there, the councils and all that don't have the budgets for 'live' bands. What they tend to do is pay X amount of budget to one live band and that's all we are going to get.

Irfan: Some of these artists have never been able to hack it 'live.' I mean if you guys were not 'live' one day we know you can still do it another.

Herbie: We sing live on stage and I don't agree with lipping where you are just moving your lips and looking in the other direction. We perform live, we sing live on top of our music and everything. In a sense that's not too bad but even though we are a live band; we will always be a live band. To keep the costs down they get four PA acts instead of one 'live' band so you gotta accommodate that.

Irfan: Sticking with Mela theme, I was at Slough Mela last weekend and they had Panjabi Hit Squad & DJ Sanj actually dj'ing at the Mela. For me it kinda defeated the object as there was a massive stage that was completely empty and the DJ's were in one corner doing their stuff the decks. Now for me that was wrong, not taking anything away from them but for me DJ's have their place and that is in the clubs and on the radio stations and Mela's should be all about 'live' acts. What do you reckon?

Herbie: Yeah, you're right!

Irfan: It just looked stupid, I mean there was a big massive stage and there was no one there.

Herbie: That's down to the organizers isn't it? They just realize they are having a Mela and it should be about live bands. When they book acts they should realize what this act does! I think some of it comes down to costs!

Irfan: Well, I wouldn't think Panjabi Hit Squad would be cheap?

Herbie: Well Panjabi Hit Squad is good; I'm sure they would have put a good show on.

Irfan: I do not doubt Panjabi Hit Squad; it's just the empty stage and all that!

Herbie: The thing is as long as you've got a bit of Mc'ing, a bit of dhol players here and there just to hype the crowd up and that. But what you said about having DJ's in the corner it's something I can't understand really!

Usman: Moving on, what's the highlight of your career so far?

Sahara In Manchester

Herbie: It has to be when I released my first album 'Temptation' as I had achieved a goal. That was fantastic, it was the biggest highlight and then obviously we released other albums, Access All Areas. One of the other major highlights was singing live in Pakistan to an audience of six and half thousand people. At one point of the event I just mentioned the word 'Sonie Ni Sonie' and the entire crowd just got up and were singing 'Sonie Ni Sonie' back to me. To hear 6,500 people singing back to me was just amazing!

Irfan: That was in Lahore, innit?

Herbie: Yeah, Lahore.

Irfan: I was there earlier in the year and they seem to be catching on the UK bhangra scene.

Herbie: Yeah, it was such a laugh over there, it was fantastic and we had a really good time. It was a really good feeling being thousands and thousands of miles away and people that I had never ever seen or met before and they were singing the songs, I mean that was really touching.

Usman: Right, we'll get the Internet question out of the way! The whole downloading thing, what's your view on it?

Herbie: If they carry on downloading then they'll finish the whole industry up. They need to go and support the artists. I mean go out and buy the album! I mean everything expensive you know like the recording the album.

Irfan: Do you think it's got to do with too many crappy albums with only one or two good songs on them and they think…

Herbie: I don't know about crappy album but in a sense you maybe right.

Usman: A good album people will make people go and buy it.

Irfan: Yeah, like if they download a few songs and think it's good then they'll go out and buy it!

Gurps: They could do the way they do it like they do with English albums were you pay to download.

Irfan: Well what happens then is one person pays for the download and they give it to everyone else [Everyone Laughs].

Irfan: We like to share stuff; we're Asian at the end of the day.

Herbie: Well it's taking money from the industry and that when artists cut corners.

Irfan: Yeah, a lot of label seems to be complaining at the moment about it.

Herbie: Yeah, well then there is no finance involved.

Irfan: So what do you think can be done about it?

Herbie: You're asking a few technical questions; I thought this was supposed to be straightforward interview [Laughing]. Well you know at the end of the day the public should realise that it's already hard as British Asians in England to make any sort of money from sales and the public should really really help us. If there are good artists out there and they want to keep the artists then they should help the artists by going and buying the products instead of downloading.

Usman: Irfan's had a chat with you a few times...

Herbie: Yeah…. yeah Usman: He basically said that you find Mc'ing cheesy; you wanna just back that up? Herbie: I gotta watch what I say to him! I can't remember saying that. Irfan: You just said it the other day, man! Usman: Ok so you don't remember saying it; what is your take on Mc's? Herbie: The thing is right the Mc'ing is needed in certain song but I wouldn't fill my whole album with Mc'ing. There are three songs out of the total eleven on my new album which feature Mc'ing. The rest of the album is different flavour but I mean it is needed as there is a market out there and our album is for

Sahara

everybody, I mean we even got a Qawali in there. So Mc'ing is necessary to certain styles of songs.

Usman: Okay far enough; lets get into the nitty gritty now.

Herbie: What have we just gone through?

Usman: The real stuff, the real stuff [Everybody Laughs].

Usman: You got a new album coming out, what can we expect from that? Who's featuring on it? Is it a new direction? Is it the same sort of thing?

Herbie: It's a more mature album; we've come up with different ideas. You can go into one shop and buy five different albums and they all sound the same. What we've done is we've put a bit of this in, put a bit of that in and we've made a good album for everybody, you know what I mean?

Irfan: You know the different styles in there are you like into all of them?

Herbie: Yeah, of course I listen to all kinds of music like Nusrat Fateh Ali Khan, I listen to Gurdas Maan; I listen to all kinds of music.

Irfan: So it's not like you've just done it for other people?

Herbie: No No No No No……No No No… I've done this album like so you can listen to it with your Dad and your Dad won't say 'oh band kar eh bakwaas!' [Everybody Laughs] You know what I mean?

Usman: Is this the new direction you are talking about?

Herbie: We are thinking more on an international level. Where not just thinking about one area of marketing.

Usman: Going back the album itself who else is featuring on it?

Herbie: It features E=MC, Singh MC and we've done a collaboration with Bakshi Salamat.

Irfan: Production-wise, who's done the production on it?

Herbie: It's done by various producers who work for UntouchablesUK and… Kam Frantic. Kam Frantic is a really really close friend of mine and he's done work on most of my albums.

Irfan: I heard a few rumours on who has done the other production with obviously RDB being the in-house producers but I've heard a few other names thrown around.

Herbie: You want to throw em then?

Irfan: I am asking you; I mean it's your album, innit?

Herbie: Well we got Frantic Kam, RDB and other various producers as well.

Irfan: Okay, now the albums name 'Undisputed' why call it that?

Herbie: Well you know we've come back and undisputed kind of thing, you know?

Usman: So like Undisputed Kings back on the scene?

Herbie: I think it was a bottle of JD weren't it [Everybody Laughs] and they were about four of us!

Usman: So you probably got it off the bottle somewhere, must have said 'Undisputed' King of Whiskies on it!

Herbie: No No … it's a boxing thing you know, Undisputed…

Usman: Ah, right…

Irfan: So like 'Undisputed' champions of the world?

Herbie: Well, yeah yeah

Usman: So you were watching the Tyson fight and that's what it was?

Herbie: It must have been!

Usman: Your last big hit 'Sonie Ni Sonie' the video, we didn't think much of it to be honest!

Sahara

Herbie: Erm okay! Irfan: For such a wicked tune you've got a typical crap video you know like with a Mercedes and a few dancers. Herbie: Fu**ing blown me out [Laughing]! I thought it was good! Well, that video was done like 4 years ago, before they exhausted all these videos on the same theme. We were on of the first bands to do a video with a car in and a few girls.

Irfan: I didn't think the girls were that bad but…

Herbie: Yeah, they were very nice!

Usman: You got there number, yeah?

Herbie: No, it was all from the record company. Basically 4 years ago was a long time ago. We didn't realise how big 'Sonie Ni Sonie' was going to be and obviously the record company just kinda budgeted like all right lads you got a video…. I mean at the time I didn't think it was that bad!

Irfan: I think it's just because it still gets played every now and again, as the tune is so good.

Herbie: It will look cheap now and it's four years on but at the time it was something different.

Irfan: With the new album, what's the video going to be like for that?

Herbie: Well, were going to India to shoot the video because at the end of the day we don't want to do the same thing, you know with everyone dancing with there hands in the air. So we are going to have a new style of video so we'll see.

Irfan: Do you what the concept is and that?

Herbie: Not yet. I'll know tomorrow when I get there [They have flights to India the following day].

Usman: So you don't have much say in the video?

Herbie: We going to have a meeting and we'll tell them what we think and ask them what they think.

Irfan: Is it going to be a Medley or one for the best track?

Herbie: All being well we shall be shooting two videos.

Irfan: Oh right, because I'm not really into all the medleys, I know it's a good marketing ploy and that but you're like listening to it and another song comes on and they just seem like extended adverts.

Herbie: Well we will be doing one main video then one medley. It's like we want to sell the songs to the public. I mean if you've got a weak album then your better doing the main song but if you got a good album they you wanna show of three or four songs; you get me?

Irfan: Cool; so what's song for the main video?

Herbie: Lal Ghagra

Usman: So you've got your new album coming out; you got anything else lined up?

Herbie: That's it for the moment.

Irfan: Untouchables normally have these mad tours, were you got hopping all around the world. Have you got anything like that lined up?

Herbie: We've got gigs lined up all around the world but I mean we've had that for the last 2 or 3 years. We've been abroad a few times; we've been to Denmark, Pakistan, India, Canada and Norway. It's been two/three years break and we've comeback with an album just to keep us in the public eye; but we've never gone away in the sense that we've completely vanished.

Usman: We've seen you perform a few times and your always biggin up Big Brother. What the score with that?

Herbie: We're all Big Brother fans, Jade Goody man [laughs].

Irfan: It finished the other day apparently but I don't watch it.

Usman: That man won it, that he….she won.

Herbie: I voted for Vanessa.

Usman: She went out a long time ago.

Irfan: What you watch it as well [aimed at Usman]?

Usman: Yeah, I watch it.

Gurps: Victor is slick

Usman: Victor was the man!

Usman: So Herbie you going watch out for Vanessa in Leeds now, yeah?

Herbie: Yeah…. that's right!

Usman: Do you have a final message for the thousands of desitunes4u.com visitors all over the world?

Herbie: I just say to all the true Sahara fans out there that keep e-mailing me, keep ringing me and saying 'when's your album out?' I am just really really thankful for buying our last album [Access All Areas] such a big hit. Hopefully, they will buy this; once again thank you!

That concludes the interview, a big thanks to Sahara for taking some time out to chat to the Northern Dream Team (Irfan & Usman). The 'Undisputed' album is out now and is available in all good shops.